Talk:Syracuse, Sicily

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Syracuse, Sicily article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1

Cities

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Cities, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of cities, towns and various other settlements on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.CitiesWikipedia:WikiProject CitiesTemplate:WikiProject CitiesWikiProject Cities articles

Sicily Top‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Sicily, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Sicily on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SicilyWikipedia:WikiProject SicilyTemplate:WikiProject SicilySicily articles
Top	This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale.

Italy High‑importance

	Italy portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Italy, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Italy on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ItalyWikipedia:WikiProject ItalyTemplate:WikiProject ItalyItaly articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Classical Greece and Rome High‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Classical Greece and Rome, a group of contributors interested in Wikipedia's articles on classics. If you would like to join the WikiProject or learn how to contribute, please see our project page. If you need assistance from a classicist, please see our talk page.Classical Greece and RomeWikipedia:WikiProject Classical Greece and RomeTemplate:WikiProject Classical Greece and RomeClassical Greece and Rome articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Greece: Byzantine High‑importance

	Greece portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Greece, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Greek history on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GreeceWikipedia:WikiProject GreeceTemplate:WikiProject GreeceGreek articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.
	This article is supported by the Byzantine world task force.

World Heritage Sites Low‑importance

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject World Heritage Sites, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of World Heritage Sites on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.World Heritage SitesWikipedia:WikiProject World Heritage SitesTemplate:WikiProject World Heritage SitesWorld Heritage Sites articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Tip: Anchors are case-sensitive in most browsers.

This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.

[[Genoa#Middle Ages and Renaissance|Genoese]] The anchor (#Middle Ages and Renaissance) is no longer available because it was deleted by a user before.

Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. | Reporting errors

Move?

Should this be moved to Syracuse, Syracuse as it is in the Province of Syracuse, and using the island of Sicily is not a standard naming convention? —Scouter Sig 23:50, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Did you go through the archive? Does anyone seriously think that Syracuse, Syracuse is better than Syracuse, Sicily? What next, New York, New York!? πιππίνυ δ - (dica) 13:42, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, I had not checked the archive; don't jump on my back, man, please. And as far as NY, NY, I think that it would be a perfectly appropriate name (if a little redundant) not only to follow conventions but for specificity. —Scouter Sig 14:27, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It was a half joke - I had Frank Sinatra's raspy voice in my head as I wrote it. πιππίνυ δ - (dica) 00:06, 30 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm guessing it was originally moved to disambiguate from Syracuse, NY. But the naming convention is fine, if anything you could say why isn't it Syracuse, Italy? _{El Greco}^(talk) 19:11, 28 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Partly because it's so closely identified with Sicily-ness, ;-/ partly because it's been part of Sicily for much longer than it's been part of Italy.... FlagSteward (talk) 18:20, 12 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Siracusa

Shouldn't this be removed from the list of "Syracuse" since it isn't known as Syracuse by its residents or in Italy? Just seems confusing for ppl like me looking for cities actually named Syracuse (looking for a University in NY) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.105.236.66 (talk) 15:55, 4 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, that's what it's called in English and has been for hundreds of years. The fact that there’s a city of the same name in the U.S. shouldn’t be a problem, just consult the disambiguation page.Campolongo (talk) 13:54, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

- I really can't see why "Syracuse" should be removed from the list. It would be a complete nonsense for two simple reason: 1. "Syracuse" will appear on the list of anyone that does a search in english and is not able or doesn't know how to spell it in italian (one of the many beauty of wikipedia). 2. Ancient Syracuse was and still is one of the most beautifull cities in the world and definitely deserves to be on top of the list before any of the other places that borrowed its name.--Sal73x (talk) 15:39, 2 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This seems to be an Americanism - like spelling the Polish city of Krakow as Cracow. Guidebooks in the UK (Rough Guides, for example), TV programmes seen in the last year or so and newspaper articles from The Times and the Daily Express all use the name "Siracusa". Sure, it was called Syracuse in the past, just like we called the Polish city of Wroclaw using the name Breslau, etc. but this is 2011. I have visited the city many times and even lived there for a while and I can assure you that nobody except the odd American tourist (and not even all of them) would use the name Syracuse.--109.115.215.168 (talk) 20:18, 17 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

It seems to be an Americanism to you because you've obviously never read a history book (in English at least), never read a book about Greek or Roman culture and art and really aren't qualified to express an opinion. Any book published in the UK will call it "Syracuse" and it has been known by that name for hundreds of years.METRANGOLO1 (talk) 15:13, 29 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The Rough Guides, for no obvious reasons, use the names Siracusa, Sevilla, Mantova etc., but then have no problem with Milan, Naples, Venice... Usage changes slowly. Note that nobody uses the names Lyons and Marseilles for the French cities, although these spellings were common in e.g. the works of Somerset Maugham. Many American and Canadian place names have borrowed European ones, so that argument is out of the question. "Syracuse" is still what first comes to mind in English, so it should be kept until more evidence to the contrary.Dinara2015 (talk) 18:20, 9 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Syracuse, Sicily-Italy

I have just been reading through the archive and couldn't believe to all the different/uninformed/wrong theories that came out! I just wanted to say my opinion about the topic even if it's been discussed and people still don't listen. Syracuse, as it has been already said, today is part of the Italian Republic! Syracusan citizens hold aan Italian passport (not Sicilian) and the local goverment (sicilian) is very limited and still subject to national directives. There was no need to move it to Sicily because there are no other Syracuse in Italy. For those that were arguing about the history and ancient times the city has been under different domination and part of many empires and kingdoms. Syracuse, today, is in Italy.--Sal73x (talk) 12:45, 3 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Primary topic

IMO this is the primary topic. Are there any other opinions on this? Thank you. --Klein zach 02:32, 15 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

WikiProject Cities Assessment

I have assessed this page within the WikiProject Cities as importance High, because of it's role in the region and listing as World Heritage site. And quality B in line with the assessments for the other projects. If you do not agree, feel free to adjust the assessment, please read the guidelines Wikipedia:WikiProject_Cities/Assessment#Instructions beforehand. CRwikiCA (talk) 13:10, 9 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Missing half century

Apart from one short paragraph, there seems to be a gap in the coverage of the article between the defeat of Hieronymous and the Byzantine era. Did nothing of interest happen during that 500 years? --Ammilne (talk) 16:14, 23 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]

3,000 hoplites?

The article on the Ten Thousand lists 300 hoplites from Syracuse. Is this a data discrepancy or is there an accounting for the other 2,700 hoplites? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.115.250.17 (talk) 18:09, 24 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed a discrepancy. As the source cited (Anabasis) says 300, I'll make the change. Robincantin (talk) 00:17, 24 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Military

As far as I know, historians believe that the Military of the Kingdom of Syracuse during its Greek era was largely militia, meaning very few professional soldiers, and mostly militia hoplites and slingers. I think this is worth mentioning. If I don't get any no's, I'm going to put it in. Smeagol630 (talk) 23:50, 29 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think it is noteworthy enough to mention it because militias were commonly employed by all Greek city-states. Taken from Ancient Greek warfare: At least in the Archaic Period, the fragmentary nature of Ancient Greece, with many competing city-states, increased the frequency of conflict, but conversely limited the scale of warfare. Unable to maintain professional armies, the city-states relied on their own citizens to fight. This inevitably reduced the potential duration of campaigns, as citizens would need to return to the own professions (especially in the case of farmers). --AlexanderVanLoon (talk) 10:34, 31 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Demonym

Well, it's fine to include the local language demonym even though that's really better handled at the Italian Wiki article, but we need to have the English demonym here. [Done and cited.] The page previously provided the (unsourced) English demonym "Siracusan"; per the OED, the actual English form uses the English spelling of the place's name: "Syracusan". I don't think the partially-Italianized Siracusan really needs to be mentioned at all but, if someone can find an RS citation for it, it's fine to list it in the footnotes or infobox as an alternate form. (Neither the OED nor M-W.com even list it.)

That said, the OED does seem to be a bit off when it says that "Syracusian" is fully obsolete. The editors to this page already used it twice without thinking anything of it; Google Scholar pulls several thousand hits for "Syracusan" but still a few hundred scholarly uses of "Syracusian" to only a hundred or less Italian scholars, writing in English, who use "Siracusan". — LlywelynII 02:44, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

IPA transcriptions in the lead

@Vaselineeeeeeee: (this is regarding this edit) True, I had both this article and Syracuse, New York opened in my browser and I mistook one for another. My mistake. Kbb2 (ex. Mr KEBAB) (talk) 18:05, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Haha, no worries, Kbb2. Regards, Vaselineeeeeeee^★★★ 18:22, 22 March 2019 (UTC)[reply]

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

Leonardo da Vinci - The Last Supper high res.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 18:55, 16 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Draft:Syracuse (polis)

Please consider incorporating material from the above draft submission into this article. Drafts are eligible for deletion after 6 months of inactivity. ~Kvng (talk) 18:19, 2 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I assume that the plan is for it to become a separate, more detailed article. I'd suggest it go to Ancient Syracuse or Syracuse (ancient city) (like the Italian wiki article); we don't generally use "polis" as a disambiguator. Furius (talk) 19:47, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Polis refers to a state, not just a city; it is very practical for Syracuse as it controlled an area that was way bigger than just a city. T8612 (talk) 20:02, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I am aware of that, although most of the territories controlled by Syracuse at the various points when it was expansive were not part of the polis of Syracuse... I still worry that it isn't a very transparent disambiguator for someone coming to the article from outside a classics/Greek history background. Furius (talk) 22:42, 5 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Climate data

Okay we've been hosting incorrect climate data for this city for quite some time. What I trust to be correct is the data currently visible on the Italian Wikipedia at https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stazione_meteorologica_di_Siracusa ... however their climate tables are in a wholly different format than ours and copying it over will take quite some time. In the meantime I just removed our table on the basis that no data is superior to bad data. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thanks, —Soap— 15:44, 11 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

population estimate (declining birthrate)

https://www.citypopulation.de/en/italy/sicilia/siracusa/089017__siracusa/ -- down to 118K, according to this site. 50.111.15.21 (talk) 08:21, 2 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]